86 Comments

A Cautionary Tale

I ran across this post by the ever introspective MMSL forum regular, DaveBowman. It really struck me, and I want to share it with the ladies reading here most of all, but it’s a good lesson for the guys too. My commentary below.

I’ve been mapping a while. Changed my life, changed my marriage. All is well & happy in Bowmanville.

However, something happened. Something difficult to write about and process, and I’m posting here in the hopes that all the Captains and First Officers that read this find some value in my story.

I’ve been in Phase 3 a few months. My wife is beautiful, sexy, kind, considerate, and a great mother. But I fucked up. I mis-timed my approach and started a bit of a firestorm. See, she was PMSing pretty bad, but we were going away to a family event for the weekend and I wanted to get me some lovin’ before we went. I knew it would be a dry spell on the weekend and thought my pure awesomeness would let me push through the clear hard nos that I was hearing from her.

She flipped out (understandably). Said some pretty harsh things about the changes in me, how she doesn’t like having sex all the time, even threw in some comments about “duty” sex not being so stellar. I held frame, kept my cool, showed outcome independence and took it like a man. She asked for me to cool it for a few days so I said “fine.”

But something shifted down deep inside. Something that frankly scared the living shit out of me. In front of me, I no longer saw my beautiful sexy wife that was in killer shape despite 3 kids and pushing 40. I saw the wrinkles, I saw the sagginess, I saw the lumps and bumps. I saw an aging, crazy, bitch of a woman. And I was… just not into her any more.

So I killed the power to the DaveBowman Love Express. Like, right off. Mr Spock cold. And just didn’t give a fuck. For the first few hours she was cool with that. By the next morning she was telling me to give it a rest. By the next night (at her family’s place) she was threatening to withdraw sex if I didn’t warm it up. I just didn’t fucking care. Like, at all. I alpha’d up. Like, way the fuck up. I was the man, I was fucking awesome. The next morning, she’s a little weepy… I’m not proud to say it didn’t bother me in the slightest. We get ready to go to a family event, she puts on a killer dress, makes a show of it for me, I don’t care. Get the kids ready and off we go. We arrive, and I’m king shit of the universe. Tons of IOIs, even from some of her close family in front of me. It’s not like anything’s gonna happen, but I feed off the energy and it drives me, shooting through me, bolstering my pure awesomeness.

After a while, I tire of it, head outside, light up a stogie. The wife hates ‘em, and it pretty much guarantees she won’t come near me. But I don’t care. As I walk around, puffing my cigar, I ponder my situation.

Thinking about my wife… I’ve been there, done that. I’ve had sex with her probably thousands of times. In crazy ways, in boring ways, in nearly every way two people can have each other. I’ve been there, done that. It’s conquered territory. And she’s not getting any younger. I think about her flaws, I think about her bitchiness, I think about what a pain the ass she is to have around. How much she cramps my style, and how much I’m just not into her any more.

I think about all the IOIs I’ve been getting. Some from hot women 10 years younger than her. New, fresh, tight, firm, hotness. Hmm… What exactly were my options here? I saw three futures uncurl in front of me, three possibilities to explore. And I understood myself, I understood the plight of my fellow husbands, and I understood the plight of the unhappy wives.

Option 1: Just give up. I mean, this is the easiest path, right? The path of least resistance. Why work my fucking bag off being hot ‘n ripped and putting so much time and energy into my marriage to an aging, increasingly dumpy wife? Why bother? Why not get a gut, ignore her, and sit my ass down on the couch and watch some more re-runs of mythbusters? Why the fuck not? Isn’t this what like 99% of husbands end up doing? And isn’t this why? I mean, if I’m not into my wife, I’m not going to give a shit if she’s into me. I’m just going to put my time in, try to stay distracted, and just coast through my miserable life. I finally understood why guys do this. Not just because they’re lazy slobs, not just because of low T, but maybe, just maybe, they’re just not into their fat, aging, bitchy wives any more. So fuck it, why bother?

Option 2: Fuck around. Maybe leave. I mean, there’s probably 5 women I know I could score with within days if I wanted. And some of them are pretty fucking hot. At least they would provide the attraction of “the undiscovered country”. I’ve never been tempted to cheat, really. Even in my sexless first marriage. I’ve just never been that guy. But… I could. I really could. And if it was fun enough, maybe I would just leave and be single, living out the last vestiges of my youth banging the shit out of the hottest chicks that would have me. I mean, I have all my hair, I’m in better shape day by day, I make tons of $, even after a divorce I’d be able to wine and dine with the best of them. Why not? What else is there to life, really, at the end of the day than just living in the moment and getting whatever joy I could out of this life?

Option 3: Try to make it work. But why bother? Why have just one woman, one that spends a quarter of her life being half bat-shit crazy and can’t help it? One that I’ve already had thousands of times and I’d be consigning to have thousands of times more… and no-one else? In a relationship that I work so fucking hard to keep going and keep hot… but I’m essentially alone in?

I went back in, undecided. Life weighing heavy on my mind. Declared it was time to go, packed the kids up, and we left. She was very quiet on the way back to crash at her family’s place. She tried to start something up after we got the kids down and we were alone in the place, but then others showed up so she shut it down. I didn’t care. Rolled over, thoughts rolling around in my mind. I think she might have been crying a little by this point… she tried threatening, pleading, anything… to go back to “the old me”. The one that she said she hated the other day. The one that sexted her all the time, had my hands all over her all the time, fucked her all the time. I said nothing, pretended to be asleep. Felt that I should be feeling something… like I should be feeling like I’m being an asshole or something… just didn’t feel a thing. Felt like a stone.

The next day we headed for home. Chatted a bit in the car. We bought some magazines for the trip. She pointed some women out in the magazines and asked me if I thought they were hot, like she often does to test me. Instead of coming up with reasons why they weren’t to make her feel better, I was honest with her. Like real fucking heartbreaking honest. “Man, I love those tits.” “Look at the ass on her.” etc. She didn’t get mad. She didn’t freak. She was honest with me back. About being wrong the other night, about taking it too far. About how the PMS just takes ahold of her and she needs some time off during those times. How I pushed it too far. About how she really likes the new me, and how she gets scared sometimes that it will stop so she tests it. She actually admitted that she shit tests me.

And to please come back to her. And always be honest with her.

I mulled this over while we got home, put the kids to bed. She asked me to have a shower with her. I felt kinda greasy from being in the car for so long, so I said “sure.”

She started things up in the shower. Hardcore. She started doing things to me that we have barely ever done before. Things that she said she never wanted to do. She did, happily, eagerly, lustfully. Told me things like “when I get like that don’t talk to me, just take me upstairs and rip my panties off and fuck me. Fuck me like a man. I promise no matter what I say I will love it.” Etc.

It all came rushing back. All of it, flowing over me like a tidal wave of emotion, lust, and joy. In front of me wasn’t a dumpy aging wife. In front of me was a goddess, radiant, erotic, and shining with energy.

I got my wife back that night, and I made my choice.

I’m writing this in the hopes that some may understand yourselves, your partners, other husbands and wives better. I sure do.

The red pill is indeed bitter. Yes things can get better. But things can also get much, much worse. Is it worth the risk? Of course. But you may discover things about yourself that you never knew were there. For me, it was my ability to be entirely selfish and to take the “wife goggles” off. For me, I understood my fat, lazy buddies who sit on the couch rather than fucking their wives. I understood why some wives that want sex don’t get it. And I understood how dangerous it is for some wives that so desperately want their husbands to take the red pill… and then get a husband that does. You may lose them if you don’t take the red pill, too. You may lose them in so many ways that you may not even see it if you’re not careful. Or they may regress further… and just not care.

Or you might just live the life of your dreams.

I found myself becoming quite emotional halfway through. I’ve mentioned before, I’m not exactly the sweetest little strawberry in the basket. I’m about 10 times better than I used to be, but I still have my moments. I’ve been rather quiet lately because we had a bit of a dust up over Mother’s Day… well, quite a big one, actually. Some words were said to me that stung like hell (totally unintentional on his part, I realize now), so I retreated into my bitch shell. It’s so very hard for me to get over things, I hold onto hurts for longer than I should. The claws came out, and I took several swipes. We withdrew from each other for a week, and I softened a bit over it a bit after a 4 day weekend out of town to see family. We’re good now. These things are happening with less and less frequency.

So now I know what it looks like from his point of view, and I can’t say that I’m not a little disconcerted. (That’s a nice way of saying “That scares the shit out of me.”) My low self esteem fuels this. I see my flaws all too well, and I very much want to believe that the wife goggles are firmly in place on his face. I know he’s passing me quickly in sex rank. I need the goggles.

Dave’s complete outcome independence was the perfect response. Totally a model for husbands to follow in that situation.

And Dave’s wife followed the text book in how to fix a tiff. Be sweet and screw his brains out.

The ending made me so happy. Forgiveness is crucial. Bitchiness is the ultimate ugly.

86 comments on “A Cautionary Tale

  1. Love this.

  2. So what happens when she gets BSC next time. She is tearful now after he showed complete indifference to her and sexed her way back to regain some control. Does she have no responsibility for her behavior as an adult. Essentially she admitted she has no control over her emotions and so he should disregard her bitchiness. As a woman it annoys me that she can use that excuse over and over again. If a man was regularly abusive and angry he would not get such consideration. Bet she can control her ‘hormones’ better now that she knows he can easily walk away.

    • Some women have bigger hamsters than others.

      I’d imagine that if she continues the cycle, he’ll follow through with a different option.

  3. So, she’s feeling under pressure, he pushes for sex, she’s hormonal and flips out, so he kills his emotions for her until she cries?

    I’m a red pill woman…but dang, can’t we women have an off day ever without fear of our man going rogue on us? For crying out sakes, I’m human. I’m going to err, I’m going to react badly sometimes, even though I’m sweet 99.9% of the time. Do I really have to worry about my man’s love being so fickle that one emotional outburst will kill his love for me? That makes me feel sadder and more desperate than I can say. I’m really hoping it’s a pattern with them…and he’s responding to the repetitive nature of these outbursts – otherwise I’m figuratively screwed the next time I’m under pressure, in pain, and low energy.

    • Well obviously this isn’t the first time she’s pulled this. He’s been mapping for a while, she’s not red pill aware, and from what I can tell they had a pretty rough marriage before he started to alpha up. Those sort of responses from her have to wear on him after a while.

      • Got it. So it is a pattern. That’s OK, long term past behaviour will predict future behaviour, and no wonder he’s sick of dealing with it and had to disconnect. I understand THAT. I wasn’t sure if it was a one time thing or not.

    • The point I was trying to make was that bitchiness is the ultimate in unattractive… She could have politely turned him down instead of telling him she hated the person he’s become.

      • This exactly. How it is done can make all the difference. Won’t bore with the details, but I have experienced character assault instead of ‘no’. Character assault is worthy of a strong rebuke.

        • This is exactly the part that I tuned into the most. First thoughts were, ouch BSC! I too suffer an immense amount of PMS, but Captain keeps track and knows, however that does not give me permission to be on the attack of him. If anything I am more punishable and he gets much more pleasure from me during these times.
          I have done far less and received far worse. She ought to count her blessings and learn from her BSC mistakes. I loved the happy ending though!

    • Congrats…you now know one of the fears a man has to go through.

      And in real life the chances of a woman going rouge when the guy errs (and he will…no man is dominate 100% of the time) are much greater than a man going rogue.

      • Hi Earl,

        I think the fear of your partner disconnecting from you is a fear both sexes experience. Red pill men are scared that one slip in frame and bang, the woman’s off out hunting for dick on the side. Women fear that one bitchy comment or crying spell and he’ll shut down, only to wind up banging a stripper. I don’t think that’s reality though.

        OK, that probably happens in some cases but I’ve had my Captain weeping like a child in my lap before, and I not once felt disgust or any negative emotion for his vulnerability. He looks after me most of the time (because I’m a woman and I cry at the drop of a hat) so I’m more than happy to carry him awhile if he needs it. He’ll put up with a little sarcasm from me from time to time because I usually make him feel like a man and I adore him…of course partners can make mistakes, but a partner who’s a friend and lover understands.

        I was just scared with the above story that the wife flipped out ONCE, so he turned cold – and everyone was applauding that. I see now that it’s a pattern of behaviour for her, so the male in me says ‘Psh, too right son. I can see why you were weighing up your options…”

        • I think flipping out is often forgivable, when it doesn’t happen all the time. No one can be 100% reasonable and calm all the time. It’s much worse when someone launches a personal attack on you and your efforts. I think people who do it know what they are doing. They feel irritated, but instead of just flipping out, they add something that they know will sting – a very personal rejection. It gives temporary saisfaction, but it’s awful for the relationship. Whenever a close friend did it to me, it was like pulling the rug from under my feet.

          • I would personally rather flip out, have a little meltdown, cry, and really express my needs than sit him down as if he were my equal and have ‘the talk’. At least with a minor meltdown it’s over in minutes as usually all you need to do is let off some steam, cry about the situation, receive a few head pats and a bit of reassurance, and you’re back to your sunny self. ‘The talk’ invites argument and logic. I’m good at neither.

            • But would you personally attack him?

            • Yes, this is key. Having a meltdown is one thing. Having a meltdown directed at your husband is quite another.

              • So true. For example, yesterday’s MMSL post engaged me for reasons I can’t explain. May be that I still can’t reconcile myself to the Donkey/Fiona concept. Anywho, I was feeling particularly emotional and snappish. I waited 4 hours to respond to a text from my husband because it was that long to calm down and not say something I’d regret. It was the article, and the crummy weather messing with me, that made me mad. He didn’t deserve a bitchy reply and I couldn’t manage to pull off anything other than that.

                The hardest part of in person communication is holding your tongue when you’re in a bad mood. The second hardest is figuring out how to let go of all the bad emotions without hurting someone so that you don’t bottle them up and have them come out later ten times as strong.

        • he didnt consiously disconnect. he didnt decide to take the “wife goggles off”. they came off because he lost his desire and attraction to her because of her behavior. cant realy blame him for an automatic reaction his body has to her behavior.

    • notice that she only wanted him again, because of how he reacted. if he didnt react the way he did she would have probably continued to bitch at him the entire weekend.

    • That’s the power of anger. One moment has the potential to destroy the work of a thousand years.

      Also, he didn’t kill his emotions. It wasn’t like he *did* anything intentionally. It wasn’t an act of agency. It just happened.

    • I really, really did not like the ‘shit test’ that she did with the magazine. That crap annoys me. I am way more likely to say ‘hey see hot, I’d love to see more of her, don’t you think so?’ and actually MEAN it, as in really MEAN that I think she’s hot and NOT get offended by my BFs response. In fact I want him to be honest, I actually enjoy waiting to see if the voice inside says ‘your not as hot as her’ or ‘lets see if I can use this ammunition’ because I generally do not have that voice, I like to see if it is permanently gone. Plus, I like looking at peoples bodies.

  4. This pulls a core triggers for me, but specifically I relate to the attachment goggles. I have found as I have engaged in an LTR, that the woman becomes more attractive. However, there was one from whom the bitch came out and I experienced the exact same thing. She became ugly ugly ugly before my eyes.

  5. Just had a similar, though not as volatile, experience. She was upset because I am neglecting her by not spending more time with her. Not sure what that means or if it is even germane to her feelings. I think what it means is I am enjoying myself with other people on blogs in a way I don’t share with her or enjoy her company. Some truth to that. Since I have always enjoyed the company of and empathized with women most of my life (not the beer drinking, hell raising, car loving kind), most of my blogging is with them. I’m sure that is a lot of the problem. In all fairness though, blogs let you talk to people with whom you share common interests, attitudes and values. If not, you don’t stick around. I can’t talk with her about those things (No. Not all or even mostly sexual) because she is more narrow in her focus of life than I am. After a while, you just let the subject drop. Ain’t having fun talking with you about it so not gonna do it. So yeah, I spend more time on the blogs than I do talking to you. Not saying all her fault, just reality.

    We recently came to one of those therapeutic agreements. Too tired or too busy or not considering or not in the mood for sex. Let’s take all of that out of the equation and try the suggested scheduling of sex. How many time per week. 3. When Tue, Thur, Sat. Earlier rather than late in the day, but no mornings. Okay. Three weeks in and a couple of misses, but no big deal because it was reasonable to miss. I even agreed with that. She had prayed about this and this was the solution she came up with. I made sure the sex was always great for her. There is a theory that great sex will lead a woman to want more sex. Just her wanting would be key to me. So, on two separate occasions she has said something along the lines of calling it MY sex time and what she is doing for ME. A proper red pill attitude might be, “Good, we have consensus on that.” I can’t tell you how much that remark hurts though. FOR ME! Nothing in it for you. You don’t look forward to it. It’s just 45-60 minutes of duty sex with multiple orgasms for you. You just feel like a convenience since that is the only time I pay attention to you other than eating out or going to a movie together. Well thank you very much for popping my ego balloon and making me feel like an undesired, inconsiderate ass. I’m really pleased that she has made it all about me and is sacrificing herself on the marital alter. Makes option 2 from above look good: Someone who wants to have sex because they admittedly like the pleasure, thrills to the pleasure, and wants to have it with you. No. It’s not what I am planning or even thinking about. I share some of the blame here by not sharing more time with her, but don’t make the medicine for the cure such a bitter pill that no one want to take it anymore. I can’t adequately convey how crushing that remark is. FOR ME! I’ve got two hands and an internet full of porn if that’s all I want.

    • Dan. BTDT. I could say all sorts of bad stuff, but precisely what you said. I t was absolutely intoxicating having someone into me.

      In retrospect, what I would do different is tell my wife that I had gotten to the place of wanting an affair to drive home how serious the problem was and see where that took us. I had made sex an issue but was slapped down on it for all the blue pill reasons.

    • Does your wife have a thing about being “not selfish”?

      I’m sure I’ve said something similar to my husband in the past, and that it was that I was trying to emphasize that it wasn’t about my selfish desires but rather what I was doing for him. And of course it came out wrong because it sounds like I don’t want him but am making some big sacrifice.

      I’ll admit there are times that I’m more interested in giving pleasure than receiving. But I realized somewhere along the way that I had this huge block about actually enjoying and desiring sex with my husband. I felt guilty about it like if I felt desire, than it wasn’t about mutual gift of self, it was just using him to get off. Yeah, I’m that neurotic.

      Also, doesn’t Athol Kay say that being a good lover is a beta trait? I’m just thinking that if so, orgasms may make her feel good and connected, but still lacking if her love language is elsewhere, while not driving attraction. Tactically, it may be ensuring you get reasonably regular sex, but it may not be really addressing her sex drive at the right point to make progress.

      • Excellent points on all counts. Thank you very much for giving me another perspective to consider. It really isn’t all her fault. I do need to invest more of my time into her but just can’t seem to find a common ground. Been married a very long time and not unhappy in any other areas. I just she were more into sex as a way of pleasure and not look upon toys, bondage, role playing, nudity, etc. as perversions or whatever her hang up is..

        • A few thoughts:

          Do you know what your love language are? Hers sounds like quality time or words of affirmation, and I suspect that your physical touch, based on what you’ve commented previously. If you’re trying to show love/build comfort, you need to speak in her language.

          Really good sex requires both attraction and vulnerability. If she has a lot of blocks or hangups, at some level there is a lack of trust that prevents full vulnerability. That’s where good beta comes in. It builds trust to allow a safe place to let go.But you need attraction as well. What are you doing to build both?

          Was there a time when she was into the areas you’d like to explore? Or has she always been vanilla? Is there moment or period when she became less creative and playful, or is this a longtime issue?

          Do you desire to do some of the things you mention because of the novelty, because you think they would create a deeper connection and greater pleasure, or because they’re a sign that she is into you? I once noticed you object to songtwoeleven’s contention that men really just want a woman who is enthusiastically into them, rather than good technique. I’m inclined to agree with Song, with a caveat. My husband finds vanilla sex with an enthusiastic me more exciting and satisfying than kinkier stuff with me reluctant. But the idea that I am so into him that I would be willing and happy to try things is more of a turn on than the acts themselves.

          Keep on.mind her hangups could come from multiple points. I have some things I won’t do because they hurt too much (some of which is changing as health improves), some because of moral objections (my husband and I are on the same page on these and I’ve learned to share articles with him that raise concern when I have quandaries), some because of body image issues, done because of emotional vulnerability issues. RPW’s role-playing posts scared me to death. Partially because I’m terrible at acting, partially because it would mean risking myself. So expect that if you can start unpacking her fears and hangups that they may come from numerous sources and thus you might get headway on something exotic but get a hard no on something that seems more innocent or easy because it hits at a spot that’s still more guarded.

          • No time now, but I will get back with you later. You have some very good input.

          • I’m not sure what you mean by I “need attraction as well.” You have brought up an interesting point about trust and vulnerability. Let me first qualify a thought as to “trust.”
            I think that initially there is a tendency in a new relationship to be more open to sexual experimentation to hold one’s place in line, so to speak. “This isn’t really my cup of tea, but I really like him/her so I’ll go along with it and deal with changing things later if it becomes an issue for me.” I think young people are especially accepting of that attitude.

            There was a time when she was more experimental and it has sense dropped off. Very good question. Never excessively so, but enough to keep me happy. So, what has changed I should be asking her or myself? Of late it has been a long-time issue. She has to be aware of the cause/s and willing to tell, of course.

            As to some of the things mentioned, both pleasure and novelty. Of course, a heightened experience can lead to a closer relationship too. I have to allow some vulnerability in myself to have those experiences. But like your husband, it is no fun without a willing partner. You don’t have to “enjoy” it, but can you find pleasure in the fact that I am enjoying it and do it for me like you might cook my favorite meal even though you don’t particularly like those foods yourself. I am not asking her to endure anal or be whipped for my pleasure. It’s not like that at all. I can find pleasure in your enjoying the ballet and thus WANT to take you again sometime. Not all the time maybe, but again for sure, and willingly. That’s what I want. If it’s a sacrifice, is there some way you can find pleasure in the sacrifice and the desire to sacrifice again. That is a two way street when it come to quality time too, isn’t it? See how helpful this is?

            Good point on the hang-up triggers and how something more exotic may be doable where something as simple and physically undemanding as lights-on or daylight sex may be totally frightening. You have been a lot of help in opening my eyes to things that were obvious but easy to overlook.

        • She is a giver. That’s for sure. When she has given too much she will begin to pull back and complain how everybody wants so much from her but doesn’t give near as much in return. Of course, I could just ask her what she means when she say it that way, duh. Could all be much ado about nothing. It is true that she is not the sensualist that I am. All of the “kink” above is not musts and deal breakers for me. I was just making the point that she isn’t a pursuer of pleasure, though she enjoys it. Some people seek adventure in erotica, others in cookbooks, other in novels. others in travel. I seek it in enhancing bodily pleasures. Yes, I’m all about touch. She is about quality time, but quality sex time isn’t what she wants most. I think we both coincided on the top three love languages, but the order varied. There is a whole lot more going on too: Tired. Aches and pains. Stress. Age. That is why we were trying the scheduling. We make time for meals, cleaning, sleeping, television, church, yard work. A lot of it done when we’d rather not. So we thought the only way we’ll take the time is to commit to the time. It was her idea. She prayed about it and proposed it. She asked my how may times a week and we started from there. I guess it’s time for a progress report and reality check.

    • Dude. Don’t schedule sex. It’s atrociously bad. It takes all the fun and tension out of seduction, and all you are getting is simply negotiated desire. If you haven’t read what Rollo says about negotiated desire and obligated compliance, do so at least five times.

      http://therationalmale.com/2011/08/25/the-desire-dynamic/

      Furthermore, it shows that she controls the frame of your sexual encounters, she decides the frequency, she throws you the bones. That does not lead to wet panties.

      And don’t project male sexuality onto female. From a man’s perspective, 45 minutes of boning with multiple orgasms for all sounds terrific. For a woman? Well, it depends what’s going on in her head, because sexual enjoyment for women largely depends on her headspace.

      • +1
        “If I make it good, she’ll want and beg for more” is covert contact, and scheduling makes the frame all wrong.

      • Thanks for the link. I will be rereading it soon. You are right about projecting my sexuality into her frame of reference. As a guy who would love to have multiple orgasm in one session, I do tend to think she feels the same. It happens to be true, but there could be other projections that are not as accurate. Also, what could be good today is not tomorrow. A lot of good stuff here to think about.

    • Definitely agree that it is foolish to try to “schedule” sex. Don’t do it. It can completely kill your relationship.

      She made that comment about it being “your” sex time precisely because that’s what it is: a scheduled time for sex. You’ve made it a chore, one more thing on her list to check off, so, of course, she’s kind of checked out. It doesn’t matter if you give her orgasms, she’s mentally disengaged.

      I know exactly how she feels. Years ago, back when my ex and I were still trying to have kids (never did happen), our already dwindling sex life was put on a rigid schedule and ruled over by ovulation test sticks. It was absolutely the most unsexy thing ever. I hated it. She hated it. But my suggestion that if we really wanted to succeed, perhaps just having more overall sex on a regular basis instead of when the pee-stick said might be an option fell on deaf ears.

      As the wife in the quoted piece said: “when I get like that don’t talk to me, just take me upstairs and rip my panties off and fuck me. Fuck me like a man. I promise no matter what I say I will love it.”

      Put up the keyboard, step away from the blog and fuck her whether she expects it or not. Follow the 14th Commandment of Poon.

      • I remember having the same experience when we were working, and working is accurate, at getting pregnant with our son. She didn’t want to be pregnant during a long hot summer, so we spent May, June, and July hitting the monthly cycle hard to make it happen. We did succeed, but it wasn’t always fun. Good, but not fun. Who would think you would be saying “Okay. Let’s go do it,” all the while sounding forlorn like Eeyore.

    • Ugh, that’s brutal bro. I learn new things on TRP every day, but the single most resounding point has undoubtedbly been to simply never get married.

      • Marriage has been both the greatest and worst thing I’ve ever done. It’s made me the happiest and unhappiest.

        If you do ever get married, you have to be super ridiculously picky about who you choose. Find a great partner who will work with you through the hard times, and it’s all good.

  6. I’m convinced if guys somehow could make sex secret society where women weren’t allowed in…women would do everything they could to have sex all the time.

    I’d call it “Your brain ruling your dick.”

  7. This makes me want to go out and buy a couple of cats. . .I’m really starting to question whether marriage is any good for men or women if children aren’t desired.

    • Uh,..what does wanting children have to do with this story?

      • This story makes me think people who don’t want children are better off not married. I still think marriage is by far the best way to raise kids who end up as stable, non-incarcerated members of society. For those of us who don’t feel the urge to procreate, stories like this make me wonder what’s the point of marriage.

        • The difficulty of finding companionship invested in you emotionally when you’re 75?

          • Yeah that’s pretty much all I can come up with too. However, considering both my grandmothers were widows for 20+ years, I’m not so sure that’s a good enough reason. Men are like Great Danes. Big, strong, handsome, fun to have around, but high maintenance as hell and they just don’t live long enough.

            • A fair answer. Best as I can say, it is not good for man to be alone…nor woman too. But it means giving up any sense of self purely as an individual. I’m still a person in marriage, but in relationship to another, in fact several others. It gets uncomfortable. It’s made me a far better person by making me stretch myself beyond my comfort zone and give up some of my more selfish tendencies, but I won’t lie and say it’s always shiny.

              You’re young and you’re pretty. I have no doubt you could catch someone. It’s another thing entirely to know if you do want to catch and keep someone in the long run.

    • Kat, you know how some of the blue pill wives are. :P If you’re not flipping out and attacking him viscously on a regular basis, you likely don’t have to worry about it. No cats for you!! I noticed your text last night, I’ll text you later today… I woke up mega sick this morning, taking care of the kidlet is proving a monumental task this morning. :(

    • Why don’t people consider swinging or open marriages?

  8. This is another difference between men and women. Men can have an eidetic memory and yet will not bring up the several hundred past wrongs since the first acquaintance. Women keep score even for imagined slights. They will not remember to include Cottage Cheese when doing the grocery shopping, yet remember in all the gory detail the ms-interpreted words from several weeks ago.

    Sartre’s “No exit” need not be hell. It merely need be a man and woman placed together where their natural (as opposed to redeemed) instinct is to torture the other.

  9. Earl elaborate more on the SSSociety. Also couldnt you assume a frame as though you were in one so to speak?

  10. Very facinating story. It almost makes me feel good about the often-hated trait of shutting down when hurt, rather than making a scene. But maybe it’s better. It makes sure you don’t say anything you will regret, and you get time to think and calm down.

    On the other hand, failing to react makes people think they can go on with the shitty behavior. And when you finally rationally think it over and dump them, they act surprised and like you didn’t warn them. But does obviously shitty behavior need warning, over and over? I always think once is enough, and the only thing I felt when reading the story was “He should dump the b**h”. However, he didn’t. He let his old feelings for her come rushing back, when she made up for the outburst. That should tell you how strong a man’s commitment can truly be. Impressive. Magical almost.

  11. We should treat our partners in intimate relationships better (if at all humanly possible) than other people. This woman wouldn’t dream of treating a friend or relative in such a manner (I assume) so I have no idea why she thinks it’s OK to flip out at her husband over something fairly trivial. His response was A++ though – there’s a good chance he’ll see considerably less of such behaviour in the future. He’s a set a boundary and established that such conduct isn’t acceptable. Full marks.

    • “This woman wouldn’t dream of treating a friend or relative in such a manner (I assume) so I have no idea why she thinks it’s OK to flip out at her husband over something fairly trivial.”

      It’s blue pill “you’ll love me no matter what I do” think. If he’s previously laid down and taken it, we start to think he won’t do a darn thing. I’ve done it too. :(

    • Thats it. He set the boundary – in total agreement. Lets hope she doesn’t try to break it too much again.

  12. My wife and I were discussing the disparity between how men and women are allowed to react to rejection. If a women rejects a man’s advances and expresses lack of interest in him, it’s considered common place. (not in red pill relationships of course!)

    But if a man dares demonstrate lack of interest in his wife, he’s an @$$hole. Her reaction to the rejection is considered his fault and he should expect repercussions.

    My wife’s initial reaction to the article was anger. But as we talked about it, she realized that she was viewing it through the lens of our relationship and what if I had treated her this way as an isolated incident. When we began discussing it as the result of a pattern of interaction, her response was much different.

    You ladies are strange and wonderful creatures.

    • I think this has prompted some very deep discussions at many a dinner table these past few nights, Captain and I included. I was a bit heated myself over the PMS induced outburst of the story. However, the monthly “curse” does not forgive a wife’s bad behavior and the blame the hormones game. When it comes to hell week, or more, both will be far better off if they are aware of the inevitable cycle that looms the little black cloud. It is a very real thing to us gals, hardcore pill swallowing lady or not , it is personality altering.

      Our solution, Captain keeps monthly track, brings it to my attention that it’s approaching so we are both extra gentle with the beast lurking deep within. This way we each play a part and I don’t feel so alone in the madness. Awareness is the key when the attacks try to seep out. The great news is, this too shall pass, but return yet again and again. Hopefully it won’t lead to the extreme Dave had to go to in order to grab her attention.

      • Calendars are a great idea. We share a Google calendar to keep track of all the things we have going on, and I have a recurring event set up for “Shark Week”. ;)

        • It is just plain necessary for our sanity when it’s more about the hormonal turmoil than the actual bleeding out. The hell is what “shark week” is truly about. If we are both in the knowing before it comes to pass, then the goal is for Captain to call me on my shit and remind me what week it is. Huh, what a concept that he acknowledges the reality of it, but reminds me it’s no excuse for being a bad girl.

        • My monthly cycle keeps changing lately – its annoying because all I wanna do is want my man ……>>> urgh <<<

  13. It’s times like these I wish I still had my own blog, cause I don’t want to comment bomb your post.

    This couple better be careful they don’t end up in a nasty cycle of her being bitchy, him alphaing up, then fucking her brains out. They could be inadvertently creating a new dynamic between the two of them, that always gets rewarded with a smoking bang session.

    Not knowing their whole story, I get the sense that he’s missing something; balance, which would have avoided the whole thing in the first place. (I agree that once in it, they both handled it well)

    He’s probably too alpha too often, cause he gets to bang her like crazy cause of it. But he’s married, any marriage or LTR needs a balance of alpha and beta, it’s his job to figure out what balance works the best. So while his post is all about what she did, and no where does he mention what he could have done differently, I’m going to offer him something – being beta at the right times is OK.

    And RPW, you’re right bitchiness is unattractive, but so is persistent asshole alpha behaviour.

    Persistent asshole alpha will help you get laid, but over the long term, it will get you single. And I guess if that’s all an asshole alpha cares about then why he took the “red pill” to better himself in the first place is a mystery.

    This is the aspect of “marriage game” that pisses me off. It assumes any reaction a female has is “hamster” or “bitchiness” or whatever. Well maybe she just had enough alpha and needed some beta, or the situation called for beta and she got alpha. You gotta learn to balance that shit out.

    • For sure. He mentioned on the post just a little while ago:

      “Let’s not forget that I brought this thing on myself. I mis-timed her cycle and tried to push through a hard no. Both no-nos.”

      So he did learn something, just didn’t mention it till later. :) (I invited him to comment here, but don’t think he’s had time)

      Balance is crucial though, absolutely.

  14. Shutting down when hurt can backfire, when she is trying to provoke a response. I warned my daughter about trying to make a man (who hasn’t actually broken up with her) jealous, because I realized that every woman who tried it overplayed her hand! Except for the one who told me (four years later) that she had been trying to make me jealous, I didn’t see through any for decades.

  15. […] any man who’s been in a long term relationship. Post courtesy of Red Pill Wifey. My comments will be in […]

  16. […] Red Pill Wifey & Mitch from Apocalypse Cometh had posts on this post from MMSL forums & holy cow, […]

  17. I remember reading somewhere that PMS symptoms can actually be significantly alleviated with a vigorous massage down there with the proper tool.

    I am not making this up. I’m honestly of the opinion that if women were less grossed out by their own body functions they would be a lot more comfortable all the time.

    • I know it’s supposed to help cramps…

      For me, period sex is pretty uncomfortable. Not because of the blood, but everything’s just more sensitive down there, in a bad way. :( Stupid hormones.

      • It probably comes as no surprise, but we man really cannot relate to that kind of pain. We have no frame of reference that I know of for empathy. For us I suspect the closest thing to cramping and overall ill feeling would be a mild case of food poisoning. We just don’t get it and probably expect it to pass much quicker than it does. It may even be like a mild kidney stone attack. It could be all of those and more because I’ll bet is different from one woman to the next. Sorry ladies. But, considering the alternative possibility, a period may be the preferred visitation.

      • This is probably too personal, but were you ever totally in charge during such an encounter? Seems like you could control your level of discomfort if the guy just makes himself into some gym apparatus for you.

  18. Seen this from the outside – a friend has been married for the last 30 years (they married young) and she would do the push-pull thing – push him away, apologize and pull him back. He always put up with it – till finally it stopped working – I could see it happening. He just stopped caring or wanting to deal with her non-sense – it was like a light-switch being flipped. The kids were in college, she has a career and was doing her thing, and he was tired of dealing with her “crazy-b*tch” option.

    So she pushed him away before he went on a business trip – unfortunately for her it was to Brazil – he didn’t come back. Called her and told her to enjoy her life, he was going to enjoy his and stay in Brazil. Of course, I’ve known them both and she’s always crying and goes from blaming him, to blaming herself. I was down there on business a while ago myself – met him for dinner. He had two young women with him – one for me since I was only in town for a day or two. (I’m single and enjoy several young women – so if any are b*tchy, I just go out with a different one and have others willing to move up when the opportunity strikes.)

    He said he’s finally “living like I should have when I was younger”. He looks about 20 years younger than he did when he left. He’s in better shape, and working out. The women were in my target age group – early 20′s. He told me he finally understood why I live as I do… His wife is paying for taking him for granted, although he punted on everything he’s worked for all of his life, but is a LOT happier. So she has everything he worked for in life – he gave it all up, to be away from her. So now she has what she wanted – something to complain about for the rest of her life…

    So when I read the above, I see where he was several years back. Getting closer to punting and calling it quits. This woman will keep pushing it till she over-plays her hand and he just shuts down. If he’s lucky he’ll decide to punt on the “crazy-b*tch”, and start another life with younger women who aren’t so much on the harpy side… If he isn’t he’ll just die inside and become a robot.. I’ve seen that happen too… And women wonder why there are confirmed bachelors – I like my toys that I worked for all of my life and while women are enjoyable, I like my life. And the reason women are “enjoyable” is because I can walk, so they are always on their best behavior and don’t take my company for granted. I’ve never had a woman turn me down when I want sex – or turn me down more than once. Since there are plenty of others and they never get a second chance…

    • Thanks for that story, JS. I wonder if the wife has the self awareness to realize, at least a little, that she should have changed her behavior.

  19. […] The Man without fear has reason to cause it in others.  He’s lethal, unapologetic, and knows his own value.  He can cause pain.  In today’s world, sometimes he knows he must: […]

  20. […] instincts they do today, but far more dread to counter it.  If a woman in other eras pulled this crap, he wouldn’t need a week-long freeze-out, he could probably just tell her parents, or the […]

  21. […] instincts they do today, but far more dread to counter it.  If a woman in other eras pulled this crap, he wouldn’t need a week-long freeze-out, he could probably just tell her parents, or the […]

  22. […] more lifetime monogamous mindset.  I put on my wife goggles; nonetheless I refused to put her on a pedestal, even though I did not concentrate on her flaws.  Unfortunately she did the complete opposite, as […]

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